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by Joshua Arnold, for the Daily Signal
Vice President Kamala Harris selected Gov. Tim Walz, D-Minn., as her running mate on Tuesday, and many Americans are naturally curious to know more about him, including his religious beliefs. Walz does not often discuss his faith, but he occasionally mentions that he attends Pilgrim Lutheran Church in St. Paul, Minnesota, (both instances are from 2020).
Here are nine facts about Walz’s church.
- Pilgrim Lutheran Church in St. Paul is a member of the Evangelical Lutheran Church in America (ELCA), a liberal offshoot of the Lutheran Church-Missouri Synod (LCMS).
In 1976, Pilgrim Lutheran left the LCMS to join what would become the ELCA over “views on the inerrancy of the Bible,” the church explains on its website. “The Missouri Synod was quite firm in the belief that the Bible was without error. Others—pastors, scholars, and lay persons—felt that the Bible, while inspired, had portions where informed people could have differing opinions.”
- The lead pastor of Pilgrim Lutheran Church is Jen Rome.
According to the church website, Jen Rome (“she/her”) “received her Masters of Divinity Princeton Theological Seminary in 2000” and “has 17 years of experience in bringing people of all generations to deeply experience and creatively connect with God, the world, and each other.” She is married with two daughters, and the family lives “inter-generationally” in a duplex with her in-laws.
On Sunday, Aug. 4, Rome delivered a homily based on a reading from John 6, in which, after feeding the 5,000, Jesus teaches that he is the bread of life. “Jesus goes on and on forever, it seems,” said Rome, but “what Jesus is talking about is setting aside or being healed from what causes you and the ones around to perish, to receive what is life-giving.”
Drawing an object lesson from a fictional, young-adult book series in which a young girl studies dragon science in defiance of societal expectations, Rome urged all her hearers to free themselves from the “garbage” of societal norms. She discussed her struggle with aging, saying her body no longer attains what she believes society expects from the female figure, adding that “it is amazing garbage that can go through this feminist’s head.”
“We humans love to make systems or hierarchies, whether that’s government, or religion, or gender, or race. We just live in all that stuff. We breathe it in, and the dynamics just circulate around in ourselves,” she said. But she imagined that Jesus would deliver quite a different message: “You, with the sick body, you are important. You, who do something for a living that others don’t appreciate, you are my child. You, who have been excluded by society for simply being who you are, whatever shape your body took, you are God’s child.”
- Pilgrim Lutheran Church pursues a ‘varied and creative’ liturgy, particularly at evening services
“Evening worship at Pilgrim is varied and creative, focusing particularly on contemplation and a sense of calm mindfulness, most notably in the music, readings, use of silences, and lighting,” the website explains. “There is no sermon, so the Celtic Contemplative Communion and Contemplative Prayer from Nordic and Other Lands services use a unique style of ‘Word Weavings.’” The church website lists multiple staff experienced in Celtic and Nordic music, led by Composer-in-Residence Dick Hensold (“he/him”).
The church’s “word weaving” aims to “combine scripture and poetry in a way that is inspired by the ancient practice of ‘Lectio Divina.’ These ‘weavings’ juxtapose phrases from the readings in new ways to inspire deeper experience with the texts.”
While most deliberate in its evening services, Pilgrim Lutheran also embraces an open-ended worship liturgy in its Sunday morning gatherings. In the most recent service on Aug. 4, for example, Rome announced a “U-pick hymn sing” after the conclusion of her homily and prayer, inviting attendees to select their favorite hymns out of the hymnal.
- At Pilgrim Lutheran Church, anyone may partake in the Lord’s supper.
“All people are ALWAYS welcome to receive Holy Communion,” announced the church newsletter. Rome confirmed this at the most recent service, declaring, “You are all welcome at this table. Whatever your age, wherever you are at in your life of doubt and faith … you are welcome at Christ’s table.”
This differs from the practice of many churches that restrict the Lord’s table to baptized believers, based on Paul’s warning to the Corinthians:
Whoever, therefore, eats the bread or drinks the cup of the Lord in an unworthy manner will be guilty concerning the body and blood of the Lord. Let a person examine himself, then, and so eat of the bread and drink of the cup. For anyone who eats and drinks without discerning the body eats and drinks judgment on himself. That is why many of you are weak and ill, and some have died (1 Corinthians 11:27-30).
- Pilgrim Lutheran Church recites a modified version of the Lord’s prayer.
After reciting Jesus’ instructions about the Lord’s supper from Matthew 26:26-28, Rome led the congregation in a modified version of the Lord’s prayer. “And now,” she said, “we pray together the prayer that Jesus taught us, saying, ‘our guardian, our mother, our father in heaven, hallowed by thy name …’”
According to the gospel of Matthew, Jesus said, “Pray then like this: ‘Our Father in heaven, hallowed be your name …’” (Matthew 6:9). The gospel of Luke contains a similar, but slightly abbreviated, teaching, in which Jesus says, “When you pray, say: ‘Father, hallowed be your name …’” (Luke 11:2).
- Pilgrim Lutheran Church welcomes and affirms people who identify as LGBTQ+ and follow those lifestyles.
“Pilgrim is a Reconciling in Christ church,” its website states, “which includes a partnership with Reconciling Works, a ministry devoted to welcoming, celebrating, and advocating for the full inclusion of LGBTQIA+ individuals in Lutheran faith communities.”
“Reconciling Works advocates for the acceptance, full participation, and liberation of all sexual orientations, gender identities, and gender expressions within the Lutheran Church,” according to its website.
Reconciling Works offers trainings with titles such as “Lutheran Introduction to Sexual Orientation, Gender Identity, & Gender Expression [SOGIE],” and “Let’s talk SOGIE.” It directs youth and families to PFLAG, an LGBTQ+ activist group that lobbies for explicit books in school libraries and against legislation to protect minors from gender-transition procedures.
All six members of the Reconciling Works Board of Directors identity as LGBTQ+, not including their nonbinary chaplain. The current chair of the board has three children, two of whom (ages 9 and 14) also identify as LGBTQ+, while she considers the youngest, age 4, to be “he/him until otherwise declared.”
In addition to its partnership with Reconciling Works, Pilgrim Lutheran also incorporates LGBTQ-inclusivity throughout its church culture. Its staff page lists the preferred pronouns of every team member, including one, a kindergarten teacher, who identifies as “she/they.” The church also hosts a trans-friendly, monthly event for mothers, advertising, “All those who identify themselves as mamas from Pilgrim are invited to a Pilgrim Mamas get together approximately once a month in the later evening.”
- Pilgrim Lutheran Church promotes at least five anti-racism initiatives.
On its “ministries” page, Pilgrim Lutheran Church lists an Advocates for Racial Equity (ARE) team, which works “to overcome white supremacy by aligning with Pilgrim’s ‘Mission of Outreach and Welcome’ and ‘Doing Justice’ as we live out the counterculture values of the gospel through education, relationship building and advocacy.”
The ARE team developed a land acknowledgement statement “to acknowledge the traditional Indigenous inhabitants of the land we are on, inspiring us towards ongoing awareness and action. The full land acknowledgment is below (the ARE team also approved a shortened version that omits the bracketed material):
“This land is not just this address. From time immemorial the Dakota people’s lives and stories have been woven together with this land. [They were forcibly exiled from their land starting with the treaties of 1837 and 1851 and were nearly exterminated after the 1862 US Dakota war. We acknowledge the Dakota people, past and present, for their ongoing story and care of this land. We condemn and lament the way colonialism pillaged both the land and the Dakota way of life. Pilgrim Lutheran Church commits to ongoing efforts to recognize, support, and advocate for the Dakota and other Indigenous peoples.] Let us take a moment of silence to honor the Dakota people, their heritage and resiliency.”
Additionally, Pilgrim Lutheran Church maintains a reparations fund “directed specifically to respond to inequities in homeownership for BIPOC families.” The ARE team has led the church in a “process of making reparations for its tacit participation in the system of housing segregation.”
Pilgrim Lutheran Church also participates in a Joint Church Anti-Racism Team (JCART), “a collaborative effort of study and action” of four local mainline churches. JCART studies varied topics and is currently engaged in studying “Indigenous/Native understanding and issues.”
Most broadly, Pilgrim Lutheran Church participates in “a multi-racial, state-wide, nonpartisan coalition” called ISAIAH, which is “fighting for racial and economic justice in Minnesota” through “activism, organizing, and political action.” ISAIAH celebrated the “bold, progressive agenda” that passed the Minnesota Legislature in 2023 and laid out its 2024 legislative priorities: expansion of green energy, publicly funded day care, publicly funded health care, rent control, and trimming down voting requirements.
Pilgrim Lutheran Church also offers a Pilgrims Caring for Creation group, which aims “to reduce material and energy waste on our church campus” and sponsors “education and public events on issues of environmental justice.” The Environmental Justice Movement battles “environmental racism” by working “to improve and maintain a clean and healthful environment, especially for communities of color.” Pilgrim Lutheran has been designated a “Caring for Creation” Congregation by Minnesota Interfaith Power & Light.
- Pilgrim Lutheran Church emphasizes social issues in its prayer requests.
On the penultimate page of its church newsletter, Pilgrim Lutheran Church lists concerns for prayer. The lower half of the page lists ongoing health concerns, those mourning the loss of loved ones, and ministry partners. The upper half of the page reads as follows:
“We pray for God’s loving presence for these Pilgrims who need healing, hope, comfort, and care:
“We pray for the people of areas torn by war and violence, including Gaza and Ukraine, for peace and safety. We also pray for those who are refugees fleeing violence seeking help and hope.
“We pray for the loved ones and communities of all victims of gun violence across our country.
“We pray for our governor and all elected officials and public servants. Guide them and support them in their work to care for our cities, our state, and our nation.
“We pray for those whose lives are altered by climate events. We pray for creation and for an increased will to care for it.
“We pray for all in the LGBTQIA+ community who face bias, rejection, and violence. We pray that we may all grow in acceptance and each become a voice for acceptance, advocacy, and support as an expression of Pilgrim’s status as a Reconciling in Christ community of faith.
“We keep in prayer our Native, Asian, Latino, and Black siblings who continue to face the legacy of racism. We pray for change in systems of oppression and injustice, and that we all may learn to follow the path of anti-racism, and each become a voice for inclusion, equity, and justice.
“We pray for our Muslim and Jewish siblings, as well as our siblings of other religions, in our country, state, and community facing prejudice, threats, and destruction of their places of worship.”
- Pilgrim Lutheran Church maintains a partnership with a Lutheran congregation in Tanzania.
Pilgrim Lutheran has maintained a partnership with the Luganga Lutheran congregation, of the Iringa Diocese of Tanzania, since 2002. Luganga Lutheran is part of the Evangelical Lutheran Church in Tanzania (ELCT).
In contrast to its mainline American counterpart, the ELCT prominently displays on its website its mission, “To make people know Jesus Christ and have life in [his] fullness by bringing to them the Good News through words and deeds based on the Word of God as it is in the Bible and the Lutheran teachings guided by the ELCT Constitution.”
Originally published by The Washington Stand
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Categories: Faith, National News, politics
I’m really not interested in the details of another man’s relationship with God.
What a weird and disappointing way to try and pick apart someone’s personal life.
Because Dems really like to “pick apart” the beliefs they imagine conservatives and more traditional Christians hold.
At least this list is from the horses mouth and not a litany of straw men.
As was clearly stated at the very beginning of this article, the writer was not relaying information about Walz’s personal relationship with God. Rather, the point was to relate 9 facts about Pilgrim Lutheran Church, to which Walz is a member. Two very different scenarios.
It is difficult to ascertain what wall’s views might be in relation to what this congregation holds as it’s worldview.It seems an easy popular way for pastors to keep membership high- and the resulting revenue coming in. Suffice it to say that DEI has been in many congregations for decades, albeit without the DEI moniker. walz inability to discern truth from fiction (Stolen Valor) his totalitarian control of Minnesota during the covid debacle and lack of action to retain order during the george floyd riots certainly clearly defines the character of the candidate. That Minnesota residents sanctioned this and did not vote him out of office further illustrates the issues the US will face in November should this harris/walz duo somehow win the election.
Particular attention must be paid to ballots and whom counts the ballots, nationwide.
I’m glad that this article broke down Walz’s church’s beliefs. If he is now the dem vp candidate then his life needs to be an open book and scrutinized. He hasn’t been very forthcoming with the issue of “stolen valor”, but I do want him to explain why you would take a child away from the parents and become a ward of the state so the state will initiate transgender hormone, puberty blockers and transgender surgery procedures without parents consent!!!! There certainly wasn’t an informed consent given by the child!!!! Government needs to stay out of mental health issues and every presidential candidate needs to make their views known and why they feel that way. For transparency reasons the Dems need to talk about their policies. No she won’t debate at Fox News —she’s rather hide until voting starts and let the liberal media run interference.
I want to know too that everyone voting was born in the USA and has a picture ID, requests an absentee ballot legally. I want to know all of this so I can make an informed choice for the next president and vice president in November.
“If he is now the dem vp candidate then his life needs to be an open book and scrutinized”
Then surely you agree Trump should’ve just released his own tax returns.
After reading this article it would seem that Pilgrim Lutheran Church is nothing more than an arm of the Democratic Party. Somewhat reminiscent of Obama, Jeramiah Wright and Black Liberation Theology. I would not be one bit surprised if Pilgrim Lutheran Church was somehow being subsidized by the organizations that they speak of.
The Evangelical Lutheran church in Africa, of which I have personally known many members, is just like the mission statement above, ” based on the Word of God as it is in the Bible.” I seriously doubt that the Tanzanian church they partner with, teaches any of this evil nonsense to their parishioners.
I have been a Lutheran (LCMS) all of my life. The church’s job is pretty much simple and straight forward, preach the Word, Baptise, declare the remission of sins, and to administer Holy Communion where the true Body and Blood of our LORD and Savior Jesus Christ is present and given to us.
Well said!
Sure. Tax returns are of TRUE primary importance here – as opposed to the reality that the entire Democrat Party both in Vermont and across the USA support the violent slaughter of developing babies in utero at ANY stage of gestation and for ANY reason including sex selection just like savage governments of Communist China & North Korea do!
And for those reasons as well as a host of others – I, for one, FULLY advocate for gleaning the details of a public servant’s supposed relationship with God, since such relationships, if genuine, are based upon the infallibility of the sacred scriptures as being the word of God – and NOT some diluted, convoluted, and adulterated jumble of New Age Communistic rubbish which further promotes more of the sacrilege which the left reveres such as abortion and environmental alarmism POSING as “Christianity” – as opposed to worshipping and ministering the actual word of Christ the Savior from the historic & Holy texts of the Bible.
Communists denounce and deny God. Walz is a COMMUNIST!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Cool now do JD Vance who converted to Catholicism in his 20’s, which is like getting into professional wrestling as an adult lol. Oh, I want to hear about what church Trump goes to too.
As a Catholic I can tell you that the church welcomes with open arms new parishioners regardless of name, rank, serial number, or age – including even those who have been disingenuous about their rank like Walz – though they must be repentant of course. New Catholics must also attend a full year of RCIA (Rite of Christian Initiation for Adults) before becoming baptized & being able to participate in other sacraments. As far as Trump goes, I don’t believe he attends services though at least he isn’t a rabid proponent of murdering babies (yes, even the Dictionary defines a fetus over the age of 8 weeks as a developing baby in the womb) in utero at any stage of gestation & for any reason including sex selection – just like Communist China & North Korea afford.
Besides, Walz is actually an avid admirer of Communism as well as being a great admirer (or might I more candidly refer to him as a bootlicker) of Islam, not Christianity at all, as evidenced (amongst many other things) by his physical posture in all social interactions he participates in with bowing as in the photo above. Of course, as opposed to the incessant bowing being part of a ritualistic or “religious” gesture – it is performed primarily by Walz not as cross-cultural acceptance, but specifically as a means to an end in order to both placate & openly plead for the Muslim vote from within his state which is avidly sought after by the DNC.
Most of the fundamental beliefs between conservatives and liberals are diametrically opposed and never the twain shall meet, at least not in this realm. The same is true as that between Jews/Christians and extremist Muslims. But from a purely historical perspective, this nation was of course founded on the ethos & the faith of Judeo-Christianity and not Islam, which makes Walz’ appeasement of & groveling to the culture & fanaticism of so many Muslims in this nation & in European countries all the more suspect & intrinsically dangerous.
Kathleen, I don’t want or ask for an explanation of Catholicism. I had 16 years of Catholic School and even taught at one, and after seeing the people that he chooses as messengers I came to the logical conclusion that God is not real.
As for Walz, literally nothing that you said is true, like usual. I don’t know much about him other than he’s a lefty but I do know that he feeds hungry kids and took in the downtrodden which makes him more Christlike than false prophets Donny or JD. He has actual military service and love for country, not dodging the draft or crafting memos from an air conditioned office.
There are approximately 100,000 Muslims in Minnesota, a whopping 2% of the state. No one is declaring Sharia law, no one is calling fatwa on each other, but when you have a myopic worldview like you, I can’t blame you. When you’re a person of faith, there are boogeyman everywhere. It would just be refreshing once in a while to meet a Christian that actually lives Christ’s values (pssst, he was a socialist)
Chris,
Jesus was NOT a socialist. There is a BIG difference between individual generosity/empathy and forced redistribution.
My mother received a letter from the Catholic Diocese ex-communicating her for getting divorced (late 1970’s.) When a priest (not my call) arrived to administer her last rites, I informed him of her ousting. His response neither confirmed or denied the deed done. Considering what Archbishop Carlo Vigano has stated (and was charged with schism by the Vatican) there is much shaking going on and more to come within the confines of many houses of worship.
I am no judge of anyone who was deceived or betrayed by an authority figure in a church, temple, or government building. A good many have been and are still being led astray with false doctrine, false idols, and false prophets. If there is no God, why are so many trying to deny Him, remove Him, and mock Him? Seems counter-intuitive to all the arguments and shenanigans over something that “doesn’t exist.” Free will, yet so many get so upset and flustered by the mere mention of His name or His word.
David, when the DOJ broke into President Trumps home in Florida and took everything—they tried to bring a tax case against him along with the other scam cases and now most have all fell apart….if I were you I’d worry more for Hunter Biden who’s tax evasion trial begins in September. Remember “the laptop” is real and back in play and if it’s brought into the trial -there is proof that “the big guy” (Joe) was included in payments for influence peddling with Russia, Ukraine, Russia and of course China. Imagine that—treason-selling out your our country!!!! I hope just this one issue is important enough to you!!! Remember Biden was VP then and had no signs of dementia.
I’m right now watching the news and hear Vp Harris has announced that if she is elected president—“No taxes on tips”. That hilarious because I heard President Trump make the same promise to a Nevada crowd weeks ago!!!! So Harris stole it but because she hasn’t had an original idea or a news conference and can answer for it. The fact is that the media is covering for her and that’s not ok.
I want everyone to wake up-and see every issue with their eyes opened!!!! our country can’t keep going down this Marxist Road and survive.
Tim Walz is far to the left and attends a church that is similar, affirming what we already know about him.
As a reminder, Walz was THE guy who called the national guard on BLM in 2020. Not all on the Left fall into the same mold.
All you need to know about Commiecrat Tampon Tim Walz.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eFPi3EigjFA
https://alphanews.org/
Search Tim Walz on Alpha News
Walz’s relationship with his church and whatever higher power he does or doesn’t believe in is completely irrelevant to me, as it is for everyone I meet. My policy is, keep it out of my face unless I ask you personally, and I’ll do the same.
What I am concerned with is what appears to be a thread of superficiality that runs through Mr Walz’s life. The guy’s entire life seems phony or scripted. Like if his moral standards were checks, they’d all come back marked “insufficient funds”. Like his entire purpose in life is to make himself far more grandiose than his intellect could ever allow him to be. It’s almost like he has lived his entire life to “check boxes”. He leans whichever way the wind blows and has no moral or ethical problem doing a 180 if the wind changes direction.
I mean, really – who goes around inflating most everything he’s done and sees no problem with doing so? There’s a psychological term for that, but it’s just not coming to me. Delusions of grandeur? Regardless, people with this characteristic don’t belong anywhere near “power”, IMHO. The proof is in the pudding, as they say. Just look at his “accomplishments” as governor of Minnesota.
In that way, doesn’t he kind of remind you of a certain German who came into power about 90 years ago?
Walz is a COMMUNIST. Communism, by federal law, is in fact ILLEGAL, so don’t anticipate his claiming it, instead we hear the vacuous term of “democrat-socialist”. And the “church” he attends to be of great significance as yet another means of ascertaining this fact. Obama himself is not now & never was a Christian in a legitimate church which preached the word of God and adhered to the doctrines of the faith. Obama is a Muslim, attended a Madrassa as a child, and hence his voracious push toward “fundamentally transforming” America.
If a leopard is showing you his spots, don’t disregard its honesty by claiming it’s not of particular import. It indeed is.
And Waltz is from Minnesota, the craziest state in the union. A sanctuary for all things nuts. Where a squad member of congress from Somalia who married her brother to get to The USA won her 4th primary for re-election and where the Mall of the Americas looks nothing like America. The same state that elected a professional wrestler, Jesse Ventura as governor and the same state that arrested citizens for violating unconstitutional covid restrictions. There’s so much more but, you have these leftists who don’t care who or what their candidate is because they have been brainwashed by an Ideology that is a cult. In their world, the devil could be called their God. What other denomination would allow babies to be killed 9 months into a pregnancy. Anyone who defends these people are just like them, empty vessels with no morals. Anyone who has taught catholic school and now is an atheist is an empty person who clines to a cult for inclusion because they have nothing else.
Chris, I am sorry you left the Catholic faith. After I was molested by a Catholic priest I left for 18 years but eventually came back and have found many local messengers of Christ whom I listen to and admire including our new bishop, John McDermott.
“Woe to the shepherds who destroy and scatter the sheep of my pasture”. Again, there is no better place for evil/Satan to infiltrate the masses wherein good & charity & love reign, than inside God’s churches.
And congrats upon your own return, for throwing out the baby with the bathwater is unwise and foolhardy. I too was far, far away for decades & there’s no better, safer, more comforting place to be in the world.
Chris, the fact that you reach such a smug & secured position with your conclusion that God isn’t real based upon personal relationships you infer you had in a workplace setting apparently wherein you term those individuals as “messengers” is very defective “deductive reasoning” on your part. How were those people “messengers” from God? Who appointed them so? The entire human race is composed of both good & evil, wrong & right, etc. and what better place for evil to infiltrate in order to affect & afflict humanity than within churches & places of worship. Therefore, since your personal postulate based solely on how it was derived is faulty, therefore so is your conclusion.
As someone who attended Catholic school, you should be aware of the multitude of evidence & proofs over the course of the beginning of recorded history on through to present day (starting with the historical texts of the Bible which scientists have only somewhat recently factually verified in terms of names/dates of births/deaths, locales, incidents, etc.) and then Eucharistic Miracles (verified by additional scientific teams), Lordes, Fatima miracles (more commission study from medical teams & scientists via decades prior to verification), Shroud of Turin, (new updated evidences by teams of scientists within differing fields) N.D.E.’s (studied & researched by major universities all around the globe in including UVA here – headed by teams of M.D.’s), Miracle of the Sun (witnessed by tens of thousands including press reporters), etc. etc.
As far as Walz goes, the mere fact that he states that socialism itself is akin to “neighborliness” is frightening in & of itself since socialism IS Communism and even Karl Marx himself used the two words interchangeably, and most scholars denote merely minor differences between the two philosophies. Though you again may personally disagree, I accept the realities of what Marx himself pronounced, as well as the nations who have utilized socialism OR Communism & the resultant catastrophic death & destruction which it ushered in & the nations themselves to be witness include past and present-day China, North Korea, Venezuela, and Cuba. The mass killings that routinely occur under such regimes & the deaths tolls enacted over time amount to hundreds of millions of citizens & include deaths through political executions, starvation, & religious persecutions.
And finally if you truly cannot see the rioting, death, sexual assault, & loss of freedoms which are currently taking place in Europe as a result of extremist Islamic rule/ideologies & which is encroaching upon our own society & culture here through the remarks of “representatives” such as “Squad” members & their allies who chant “Death To America” at rallies as their cohorts cry it is their “freedom of speech” to demand & threaten the deconstruction of the USA, then I would recommend alternate news sources, for such speech & violent acts as we have seen over the course of the past 6 months alone signal imminent danger & are not permitted under the 1st amendment of the Constitution. And numbers of this population who largely have no interest whatsoever in adapting to American culture but are instead intent upon imposing their own violent & misogynistic rule are not as insignificant as you describe them to be – though exact numbers aren’t available due to illegal immigration, it is estimated to be approximately 5 million Muslims within the nation & growing and indeed their votes are irrefutably sought after by the DNC., hence the public bowing readily seen repetitively particularly in MIchigan & Minnesota by Walz himself – one of the very reasons he was chosen as candidate after careful machination by your DNC.
Kathleen, I didn’t call you weak or mentally ill, so I don’t need to be called smug by someone I don’t respect. I will acknowledge that this is by far the most civil you’ve been to me. I don’t begrudge religion because I understand its purpose and if you need to believe in fairy tales to get through your day, or like you, need the threat of eternal damnation to be a good person, I get it.
Let’s start with god, little g. Where’s the proof? I don’t mean rainbows or burning bushes, give me some proof. Give me something real (Fatima never happened by the way)
I learned in college chemistry (you should go) that the Shroud of Turin was radiocarbon dated with 98% accuracy to around 1260. Anyway you move the goalposts, give me some proof of the big man coming down and saying hi. Not a rainbow, not a burning bush. The man. You can’t because he doesn’t exist. How do I know? Because religion, and more importantly the idea of a higher power evolved spontaneously across cultures as a way for humans to make order of the chaos around them. In small words, it was way easier 3000 years ago to blame a volcano or storm on an angry god than to understand the weather (even though some people at VDC still don’t) No proof, no pudding.
“And finally if you truly cannot see the rioting, death, sexual assault, & loss of freedoms which are currently taking place in Europe as a result of extremist Islamic rule/ideologies” Again, this is blatantly untrue. However, there has been a dramatic uptick in violence AGAINST Muslims in Europe, especially Britain brought on by the fact that a bunch of people on the dole want to blame others for their own apathy.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/2024/08/12/uk-riots-racism-muslims/
Save your breath because neither of us are going to change each others mind, I did appreciate the fact that you were 98% civil to me. Baby Jesus must have been watching
Chris,
God is real. He is everywhere. That is my belief. I respect your belief though I think it is erroneous.
The problems in Europe are NOT easily categorized. There is a fundamental difference in moral attitudes between the Muslims in the UK and the native English population. Most worrying is that the political class has decided that rape gangs, cousin marriage and police no-go areas are not problems while “working class bitterness” and “racism” and “hate speech” are to be tackled aggressively.
The Rotherham report detailed widespread abuse of young white girls in Northern England. The Rochdale child abuse ring operated for over a decade. These are proven facts.
It is easy to overlook the social problems uncontrolled immigration create. Until those problems explode into the open. By then, though it is usually too late.
Chris, Sorry but this site is designed for expression of one’s opinion via the right to freedom of speech, as well as freedom of the press. I do consider you smug, but how that is intrinsically tied to verbiage such as calling another “mentally ill” in your mind is not clear whatsoever. Thereby it remains inconsequential to me.
As far as proof of God with a capital “G”, I already provided you numerous examples in my last post right on this thread which you have obviously totally ignored or didn’t bother to read – so assured of your aforementioned faulty deductive reasoning that you cannot bring yourself to explore or even broach the proofs as listed. Not only is such an arrogant attitude contradictory to scientific analysis, but it’s not even a characteristic sought after in the teaching profession, as the art of properly teaching students is to demonstrate how to explore & research and think independently – as opposed to be dictated to via adopting the instructor’s own theories and philosophies.
As far as your link to the biased Washington Post article, I don’t partake of the DNC-controlled propagandized press any longer for the exact reasons that former Senior NPR Editor Uri Berliner resigned over, that being the inherent “absence of viewpoint diversity” (his description) that “news” agencies such as NPR and other mainstream sources proffer. However, if you wish to forward any similar “conclusions” advanced by the Washington Times that propositions include similar, complex & unbiased scientific protocol as utilized by the Catholic church in investigating & researching the conclusions they arrive at, go ahead and forward that.
In terms of civility, I would state that generally in life one receives what one affords, as you were also civil to me. Or as the New Radicals once sang in a favorite song of mine: – ….”Don’t give up, you’ve got a reason to live, Can’t forget, We only get what we give”.
And you’re 100% right! God is always watching!!! Though the baby you reference was merely a babe for a short duration as we all are, once he incarnated as a human. He entered adulthood, as we all know as described in the historic text of the New Testament, to minister to the world, be put to death, & become the resurrected Christ. Chris, no offense, but you need to desperately brush up on your Catholicism. And if I may respectfully add, try to additionally uncover why you & the approximate 4% of the populace are driven nearly literally mad by the fact that the majority of the populace believes in God, including 76% of physicians, just as a point of interest.
The same New Radicals that played at Sleepy Joes inauguration?
I can tell you exactly why 76% of physicians believe in god little g. Because it’s a profession. They aren’t gods, they take a test. They too can’t comprehend that this is it and that’s okay.
I know my Catholism way more than you. I asked for evidence, you gave me weather patterns. You refused to look at mine because can’t you can’t give me any evidence, you just move the goalposts. Let me ask you, if Catholicism is so great, why did god allow his shepards to molest their flocks? Why is the Catholic Church still the largest owner of private property in Vermont? Because it’s a 2000 year old Ponzi scheme. Still waiting on evidence, not the three little pigs
Queer, weird, whatever… same meaning. Wasn’t that supposed to be the thing to make weirdness normal? Oh, never mind the meaning. Words shape-shift all the time just for the Hell of it. And those who choreograph circuses in one ring really don’t like it when some other clever choreographer creates a circus in another ring. How dare you make fun of my circus when mine is real and yours are lies!!??
Every hand bends toward itself. That is a Hungarian saying.
Everyone’s church demonizes the other person’s church.
Even within any one religion, there are separations and many houses of worship.
Most people can’t even get along with blood relatives, never mind the community at large. I see this in the grocery store every shift I work. People make assumptions of others without even knowing what “church” they go to. And the majority of customers, who consider themselves to be merely transient and anonymous when at the store, are truly a bunch of mindless twits, in all sincerity. That’s every social and income class, BTW. Mindless twits.
I have the pleasure of working PT as a retired person due to the cost of living.
In a way, it makes me a lot more understanding of the stupidity of all this nonsense.
Everyone wants to be right and begins with the premise that all others (unless you literally communicate your shared group interests) are wrong.
Chris – The angrier you grow when the faithful are able to effectively refute your belief in “nothing” in terms of religion & God & creation, the more irrational & inexplicable your comments become.
It was merely a day or two ago you spoke of your personal associations with supposed “messengers” of God and demanded the typical “evidence” of the existence of God which I promptly provided you with summarily, and which you have as yet completely failed to acknowledge or refute. And yet you now claim to have provided me with similar studied, researched evidentiary proofs from comparable reliable sources., which you certainly have not.
The usual played out critiques of the Catholic church have absolutely nothing to do with the reality of God, but rather represent the very sins, the wrongful actions, & the failings of humankind within a world which remains imperfect & flawed since the beginning of time & which give grounds for the very reason God became man, suffered, died, & was resurrected — in order to become the salvation for those who accept Him in this broken world begat by the fall of man through original sin. In conclusion, the burden of proof & of persuasion was met not only via the list I provided, but through your very own indignant words in your failed attempt to blaspheme the Christ.
Despite your pronouncement with regard to your supposed broad knowledge of Catholicism, your very own statements belie that you in fact appear to lack the most fundamental grasp of Christianity. God is the savior of sinners, and He in fact stated clearly “I have not come to call the righteous, but sinners to repentance”. And to all of those who have been injured by sin – which is virtually every single solitary human who has ever walked the earth – God tells us that “Behold I make all things new (i.e.: “right”) in terms of our suffering, pain, & sorrow.
Lastly, in terms of three-quarters of medical doctor’s (those who possess far superior levels of education, training, & knowledge than do teachers in the elementary/secondary public or private school systems) & their belief in God, if you had ever read either one or two of the multiplicity of books (readily available on Amazon or a local library system) authored by dozens of M.D.’s, specialists, & surgeons about their own firsthand experiences, along with the plethora of scientific and peer reviewed extensive research conducted over the course of over three-quarters of a century at leading teaching hospitals worldwide which provides preeminent & distinguished testimonies, verifications, and yes, evidence of the afterlife and of God…….you might learn something!! But you won’t. You cannot. “For only a wise man will hear and increase his learning” Proverbs 1: 5
Everyone needs their own personal family church inside of their home that they write off 10% of their income to put towards. Why wouldn’t everyone take that amazing tax advantage to energize their spirit in the way they choose best fits for themselves?
Most organized religion feels corrupt and something God wouldn’t condone most of the time. Maybe a religion like this could be centralized for an easier accounting process, whereby the members decentralize their own services as part of that religion, under the same umbrella/tax ID.