By Mike Donoghue
A version of this news story appeared in the award-winning Vermont Standard newspaper in Woodstock this week.
A federal judge has given permission to the Mid Vermont Christian School to file an amended discrimination lawsuit against state and local education leaders while also challenging Vermont’s new controversial education law known as Act 73.
Senior Federal Judge Geoffrey W. Crawford gave the green light in a four-page decision on Monday that approved the request filed by the school in Quechee in November.
Mid Vermont had sought:
- The addition of a new claim under Vermont’s Act 73 — the recently enacted school funding legislation restricting tuition payments to independent schools — on the grounds that it violates the free exercise clause of the First Amendment
- The addition of claims of personal liability against Jennifer Samuelson, chair of the Vermont State Board of Education, Zoie Saunders, the secretary of the Vermont Agency of Education, and Jay Nichols, executive director of the Vermont Principals’ Association.
- A revised claim against the Waits River School Board in Corinth by different parents seeking tuition payments to Mid Vermont.
Crawford noted the defendants did not object to the amendment concerning the newly enacted funding statute.
“Their opposition is focused on Plaintiffs’ decision to seek to impose personal liability on the cabinet-level state officials charged with implementing Act 73 as well as defendant Nichols…” Crawford said.
“Defendant Waits River argues separately that, as a school district, it is obligated to follow state law — including Act 73 — and cannot be liable for doing so.”
Crawford heard legal arguments for about one hour on Dec. 17 and had hinted he was likely to grant the request. He promised the lawyers he would put his thoughts into writing.
He noted Mid Vermont could withdraw the case and start over again with the amended lawsuit that it had shared earlier with the defendants and still end up with the same outcome.
The defense lawyers offered little objection.
The original civil lawsuit was filed in November 2023, but most of it was placed on hold when the two sides battled over a possible preliminary injunction. It eventually ended before the U.S. Court of Appeals for the Second Circuit in New York City, which issued a brutal opinion slamming the way Mid Vermont Christian had been treated.
Crawford noted “The rule requires the district court to ‘freely give leave when justice so requires.’”
He said there was no undue prejudice to the defendants in granting the motion.
“The court can quickly reject allegations of delay and bad faith. This case remains at a very early stage of development due to the time required to resolve the preliminary injunction issue. The interlocutory appeal effectively stayed motion practice and discovery Neither side can be charged with delay or with bad faith. There have been no prior amendments.”
He said part of the requested amendment was timely.
“Plaintiffs could not have attacked the constitutionality of Act 73 any earlier since it was recently enacted. Although some of the defendants assert that allowing amendment will require them to expend resources in the expanded litigation, this is not a case where plaintiffs have unleashed a new theory ‘on the eve of trial’ or after the parties have already prepared analysis of the case through the summary judgment lens,” Crawford explained.
The new law excludes the private Christian school in Quechee and all religious approved independent schools in Vermont from town tuition funding and other public benefits.
The request to amend the two-year-old lawsuit came after the three-judge panel in New York City granted a preliminary injunction in September against the VPA and Nichols, its executive director.
The stinging decision noted the religious discrimination imposed by the VPA and Nichols, court records noted. The judges ordered them to reinstate MVCS as a full member pending the outcome of the lawsuit.
The appeals court ruled the statewide association discriminated against Mid Vermont Christian when the school opted not to play in the girls state high school basketball tournament. The school filed an objection when its first round opponent, Long Trail School in Dorset, was using a transgender player, the court noted.
Mid Vermont said at the time — and still maintains — it had a serious concern that the transgender student, who was more than six-feet tall, created an unsafe and unfair situation for its girls, court records said.
Mid Vermont’s lawyer Ryan Tucker, had maintained the named defendants would not face any disadvantage because they never filed a written response to the initial lawsuit in U.S. District Court during the past two years.
Nichols and the VPA, along with Saunders and Samuelson had led the fight to block the amendment.
Mid Vermont has maintained that the religious discrimination by the state continues.
Several weeks after the 2025-26 school year began, two MVCS students were told that they could not participate in the Vermont Early College Program. The enrichment program normally allows high school students to take free classes at state universities. The students were denied because of enrollment at MVCS even when their parents pay state and local taxes.
Mid Vermont and two families initially filed the discrimination lawsuit against various state and local education officials for expelling the Christian school and its students from the state’s athletics association. One family eventually dropped out of the lawsuit, but now Mid Vermont lawyers say in their motion, which was filed Friday, that another family wants to be added as a plaintiff. They claim they also face harm from the discrimination.
The plaintiffs are supported by The Alliance Defending Freedom, a nationally recognized law firm known for its First Amendment fights. They have won a handful of discrimination lawsuits in Vermont in recent years.
Quechee School claims religious discrimination by state
The 2023 banishment by the VPA was seen as unprecedented. The Windsor County school had been a loyal dues-paying and active member for 28 years, court records show. No other school ever was banished fully from the VPA.
Mid Vermont is a private Christian pre-K through grade 12 school founded in 1987. It draws its students from nearby counties in the Twin State region.
“The school believes that forcing girls to compete against biological males would affirm that those males are females, in violation of its religious beliefs,” the appeals court said in September.
“We conclude that Plaintiffs are likely to succeed in showing that the VPA’s expulsion of Mid Vermont was not neutral because it displayed hostility toward the school’s religious beliefs,” the court ruled.
The judges said they found open hostility by the VPA toward Mid Vermont Christian. The court also noted the VPA failed to follow its own rules and policies in its rush to dismiss the Christian school from the statewide association.
The ruling overturned a decision by Crawford that allowed the banishment to remain in place while the two sides battle in court. The appeals court ruled the school can now participate in VPA-sponsored events while the case continued, but it is unclear if they have been allowed to enter any VPA-sponsored athletic events.
Crawford initially denied a request by the Plaintiffs for a preliminary injunction in June 2024. They appealed and also asked for an injunction pending the appeal, but Crawford said no again.
It was at that point that Crawford had questioned why the VPA banned MCVS from all activities. The judge helped broker a plan during a court hearing to allow Mid Vermont students to participate in non-athletic VPA sponsored events, including spelling bees, science fairs, drama festivals and debate competitions. The VPA was cool to the idea, but eventually agreed to the idea before the court hearing ended.
“In sum, Plaintiffs are likely to succeed in establishing that Defendants acted with hostility toward Mid Vermont’s religious beliefs. The VPA Executive Director publicly castigated Mid Vermont — and religious schools generally — while the VPA rushed to judgement on whether and how to discipline the school,” the judges wrote.
“In upholding the expulsion, the VPA doubled down on that hostility by challenging the legitimacy of the school’s religious beliefs. And as noted above, the punishment imposed was unprecedented, overbroad and procedurally irregular,” the appeal judges said in their 19-page decision.
“Those facts strongly support the inference that Mid Vermont’s religious objection was not considered with the neutrality that the Free Exercise Clause requires,” they said.
Discover more from Vermont Daily Chronicle
Subscribe to get the latest posts sent to your email.
Categories: Education
I’m not Christian, but I’m sending MVCS a donation. They’re doing more to fight back against the communists in the VPA and the State Board of Education than the Scott Administration or republican legislators.
So true, so true, when are others going wake up!
They have won a handful of discrimination lawsuits in Vermont in recent years.
You have to go outside of the Vermont courts system to get justice, in many cases, Vermont being poor can easily make court cost prohibitive for legal fights in the David vs. Goliath sense of things.
Notice what side Nichols is on.
At all costs Vermont wants to protect its school bureaucracy!
They will not be denied power and money!
After all it’s all about the________!
Normally the blank is filled in with propaganda….and people eat it up. But a normal person would fill in the blank properly without any hesitation or coercion.
Plus now with hundreds, literally, of Dem NGO’s fighting for them it costs millions in Court filing and attorney fees to even get to an upper Federal Court! Reportedly the Federal Judges offices agreeing with NGO’s repeatedly haven’t collected the necessary filing fees from the attorneys of their friends, resulting in millions owed.
….And here we go again. Wasn’t this already decided by the U.S. Supreme Court already back in 2022 with the case involving the State of Maine? (I think this was Carson vs. Makin)
In that similar case, the court ruled that Maine violated the Constitution’s protections that guarantee freedom of religion.
Vermont however apparently believes that by violating settled law, they gain both traction and time in their quest for the Godless dystopia they fantasize of. And in now potentially waiting for this to be taken up once more by the court systems, they are but once again “wisely” using YOUR tax dollars to do so!
No, Vermont. The cunning and manipulative tweaking to school choice policy of your years’ long plot to somehow, someway undermine that past decision wherein PARENTS may choose parochial schools as opposed to your public institutes of political propaganda will eventually fail.
And if the citizenry can see through your sleight of hand, do you not think the Justices will?
You see “legislators”, in the end? GOD WINS.
My understanding is in Carson V Makin the SCOTUS decided that if a state has a tuitioning program, schools cannot be excluded based upon religion. Some sneaky legislators figured out a way to exclude Christian schools without openly repealing Vermont’s town tuitioning law, and many Republicans voted for it anyway. Note our governor is still pushign Act 73 and many Republican legislators are falling in line. Has our governor made any public statements about this? Guy, have you asked Gov Scott about this amendment to Mid Vermont Christian’s lawsuit?
If religious and independent school want my tax dollars they need to adhere to the same standards, accountability and provide the same accommodations that are required of public schools . Simple as that.
“adhere to the same standards, accountability and provide the same accommodations that are required of public school” That won’t be very hard as Vermont education outcomes are going down every year. From Art Woolf who was an economist under former governor Madeleine Kunin: “Nationally, 87% of students graduate from high school. Vermont trails the nation at 83% and only nine states have a lower graduation rate than Vermont.” “On the fourth-grade reading and math tests for NHW students, only three states scored below Vermont. Vermont scores for eighth-graders are a little better, but not much. Vermont’s rank puts eighth-graders in the bottom eight states for math and the bottom four for reading.” Times Argus Jul 16, 2025
Thanks for the info mark but I was referring to an independent or religious school’s adherence to policies that relate to nondiscrimination, health/safety, financial solvency and the state’s instructional standards. Also the implementation and adherence to state-required assessments that provide performance data to the Agency of Education. These are all items that if a publicly funded school is found to be out of compliance with they risk losing their public tuition eligibility. I expect any independent or religious school to follow and comply with these same specific standards if they wish to receive public tax dollars via tuition reimbursement.
David Davis, U.S. Constitution applies and Christians pay taxes, too.
David Davis, “If religious and independent school want my tax dollars they need to adhere to the same standards, accountability and provide the same accommodations that are required of public schools . Simple as that.” So, are you saying your tax dollars are voluntary? What do you mean by “same accommodations”? Do you mean accessibility for those with physical or mental learning challenges? What do you mean by “Standards” and “accountability”? Generally speaking, private schools with a Christian worldview generally provide a better academic education than public schools. Are you saying you want religious schools to meet the same mediocre standards as public schools? Mediocrity for all? Do you want your “voluntary” tax dollars to fund an “education” that teaches elementary school students that “gender” is “fluid,” and keeps two sets of records for students who are “socially transitioning” – one record for the school and one record for the parents? Do you acknowledge that Christians also pay taxes?
That’s too many question marks for me to tackle Renee.
Simply put, I feel any and all schools that receive public tax dollars must adhere to the same admissions, academic and professional standards. Standards set and regulated by the state. If standards are not met or maintained funding should be withheld.
Too many question marks for you to tackle, David? Really? The questions are simple and direct. What a cop-out.
I read your comments and questions and gave my simple and direct response.
“Thanks for the info mark but I was referring to an independent or religious school’s adherence to policies that relate to nondiscrimination, health/safety, financial solvency and the state’s instructional standards. Also the implementation and adherence to state-required assessments that provide performance data to the Agency of Education” David, I am less concerned with so called “Standards” and more concerned that Vermont children are getting a decent education. If you read Art Woolf’s essay you realize they are not. I like Mr. Woolf’s commentary as he focuses on the data. The education establishment in Vermont is failing its children miserably. Many parent now realize that and want change. Change is not happening in public schools because the VTNEA, VPA and VSA don’t want it to change. Change will lessen their power and they don’t want that. As to your comment on adherence to provide performance data to the AOE, I will say this: I used to live in Peacham Vermont. When our taxes were going up over 17% in 2024 I wanted to understand how well the school was doing as I could find little data on AOE website. I asked the School Board for this data and they directed me to the principal at the Peacham Elementary School. This was the response I got: “I cannot share data with you that I am not able to share with the rest of the public. I could potentially be violating student privacy laws as legislated by FERPA. These are federal guidelines. Any data requests that you feel you need to make should go through the CCSU district. The district Superintendent, Mark Tucker, is copied on this email. The federal government restricts sharing of student data under FERPA legislation.” So I as a taxpayer was expected to take their word that the school was doing great. How many other schools in Vermont are not sharing performance data? I am not deeply religious but if I was still raising a school age child, I would rather they go to school like Mid Vermont Christian School where they actually focus on learning vs being indoctrinated and adhering to some so called standards, standards that I may or may not agree with.
Mark Milazzo, it looks like you received a cop-out answer to your request for academic performance data. Individual students are not identified in performance stats. FERPA covers individual students, not general performance statistics.
David Davis, you are dodging simple questions. Do we teach children in public schools that there are two genders, or more than two? It’s a simple question. I know parents who are not Christians who send their children to Christian schools because Christian schools provide a superior academic education, free from ideologies based upon falsehoods.
Do you know what the Supreme Court needs?
Nope. Not more justices. Not “Congressional oversight”. Not term limits.
An ENFORCEMENT ARM!!!!!!!!!!
And yes — Armed.
No thank you. As an American I feel it’s extremely important to maintain the precedent in which military interference in civil matters is prevented.
You’re so brave and Christlike wanting to turn the military on people that you don’t agree with.
I am brave, courageous, outspoken, and Christlike as I demand accountability for those who violate extant law and attempt to thwart innate Freedom of Religion for all.
Yet no matter what Vermont and her radicalized lawbreaking followers attempt in this especially pernicious venture, in the end – God wins. Always. And forever. Cox
By the by, all parochial and/or private schools within the state and across the country must by law meet educational standards in order to operate.
Specifically, the U.S. Department of Education mandates:
Accreditation/Registration/Licensing/Approval
Teacher Certification
Length of School Year/Days
Curriculum
Recordkeeping/Reports
Health and Safety Requirements
Transportation
Textbooks
Testing
Special Education
Nursing and Health
Technology
Professional Development
Reimbursement for Performing State/Local Functions
Tax Exemption
Public Aid for Private Education
Most parochial schools & particularly Catholic schools, however, do NOT meet educational standards.
They EXCEED them.
Teaching in Vermont’s public schools requires participation in a developed licensure process through the state’s AOE. Public educators are also required to participate in ongoing professional development in order to maintain their teaching license.
Teaching in Vermont’s independent, private or religious schools does not require a license. Working as a teacher in those environments simply requires any type of bachelor’s degree. And once hired are not required to further develop their professional skill set.
This is simply one example in which public and private schools in Vermont are not held to the same level of accountability.
“Teaching in Vermont’s public schools requires participation in a developed licensure process through the state’s AOE. Public educators are also required to participate in ongoing professional development in order to maintain their teaching license.” David, your arguments are falling on deaf ears. You keep referring to standards and regulations that public schools must adhere to. Vermont schools are failing. The data is clear. How are all the standards and regulations you keep alluding to working to better educate Vermont children? Not much. Parents and taxpayers have figured this out. They want choice and should have it but the Vermont legislature is controlled by the VTNEA, VPA and VSA. Again, please read Art Woolf’s commentary. If you feel the his data is inaccurate then please show us where and why.
Complete and Utter FALSEHOODS.
Private & parochial schools ARE (sigh, yet again) licensed as per the United States Department of Education as very clearly and concisely reported above. As with FEDERAL laws, all federal laws trump any state laws.
Secondly, ALL teachers in private & parochial schools, in order to be licensed & accredited as so mandated – MUST hold a MINIMUM of a bachelor’s degree in order to teach herein and in every other state. Many states, in fact, require a master’s degree (like neighboring NYS) in order to teach, making Vermont’s public-school teachers merely MINIMALLY qualified compared to both other states within the union, as well as many of their “counterparts” within parochial/private schools that possess an advanced degree.
Reporting & repeating fraudulent propaganda (in this case blatant lies) does NOT force the masses to believe you as professed by radical Saul Alinsky.
Parents & Guardians:
Do you wish for your children to receive a superior education free from political propaganda & radicalized ideologies such as DEI and BLM and LGBTQWHATEVER?
REMOVE your charges from the public schools of indoctrination in VT and send them to one of the numerous parochial & private schools successfully preparing children for learning & for life!
Next.
You continue to label my facts as falsehoods.
Fact:
Unlike a public school teacher, one does not need a Vermont teachers license, as granted through the AOE, to teach at an accredited independent, private or religious school in Vermont. Turns out, they don’t even need a college degree, just some “equivalent time in training and experience in their field of instruction.” This fact is clearly stated within the state’s guiding statute provided below.
Pursuant to Act 173 of 2018, as amended, these rules take effect on July 1, 2023:
2227.5.1 For teachers, a minimum of a bachelor’s degree in their field of instruction or substantially equivalent time in training and experience in their field of instruction.
https://education.vermont.gov/sites/aoe/files/documents/SBE%20Rule%202200%20Adopted%20Rule%20Filing-2022.pdf
David Davis is correct in that not all who teach at private schools in VT are licensed. The Heads of Burr & Burton and Long Trail spoke about this flexibility during a Senate Ed Committee meeting Feb 1. What is false is that all teachers need to have education degrees and licenses in order to be effective teachers. Independent schools have this flexibility while public schools do not. Also most who homeschool do not have degrees in education yet are generally more effective teaching their own children than the teachers in public schools.
A very interesting exchange of questions and answers with no insults. Congrats.
My thoughts and feelings are simple and are not enhanced with insults.
Primarily, if an educator is to be paid using public funds, they need to be observed, evaluated and licensed through our state’s AOE.
Should have read ‘no results’.
David Davis:
The TRUTH, unlike the falsehoods that you continue to present, are available directly on the:
1.) United States Department of Education
2.) National Catholic Education Association
Vermont and the USA’s joint requirement for a bachelor’s degree is the MINIMAL requirement necessary for licensure to teach.
ALL private & parochial teachers in VT are licensed, thereby………
Many states, such as neighboring NYS – but NOT Vermont – require a minimal of a master’s degree for licensure.
Many private & parochial schoolteachers also hold master’s degrees where they teach.
Vermont public school academic performance ranks in the bottom half of the 50 states.
Parents & Guardians:
For a Superior Education and Experience that Prepares Your Child for Life and EXCLUDES political propaganda – REMOVE your children from VT’s poorly performing public school system and enroll them in one of the successful private/parochial schools within the state!
Next.
Kathleen,
You write, “ALL private & parochial teachers in VT are licensed, thereby………”
This is absolutely false. Many teachers at Vermont’s independent schools do not hold teaching licenses issued through the Vermont AOE.
I’m not sure if you’re confused about what “licensed” actually means within this specific context or what, but your incorrect insistence has become tiresome. Happy new year and good luck out there.
David is right about private school teachers not needing a teaching license. I can also say that some towns without a school can sometimes opt to tuition their students, using tax money, to a private school. I see both sides of this but as a former truck driver, I don’t know the answers to this issue.
Thanks for the support Dan.
I’ve chosen to give up on correcting Kathleen’s misunderstandings regarding the common practice of Vermont’s private schools employing educated, yet mostly unlicensed teachers.
And to anyone else reading along here, just ask Google:
Do I need a license to teach at a private school in Vermont?
Make sure to share the answer below 😉
Sorry to you both, as you are mistaken, as evidenced by the “links” above.
I already provided the TWO organizations as references that clearly & concisely state what is required in order to teach in Vermont and most importantly within the U.S. Perhaps if you actually read the mandates, that “might” be of assist.
Here they are listed yet again:
1.) The United States Department of Education.
2.) The National Catholic Education Association.
In addition, I also provided above, in writing, the precise requirements the Education Department requires for ALL teachers to hold within ALL fifty states. This INCLUDES a license.
Neither public nor parochial schools or private schools CAN allow unlicensed teachers to be teaching students in VT schools or any other schools within any other state.
There are NO parochial or private schools operating ANYWHERE in this state with unlicensed teachers or teachers that do not MINIMALLY hold a bachelor’s degree. This is disallowed and pure propaganda in an attempt to dissuade you from choosing a better-quality educational choice – Private & Religious Schools!
Parents & Guardians: opt for a real education for your youngsters! Enroll them in private or parochial schools today!
Next.
And since I provided references, now anyone who proclaims that parochial schools employ teachers within Vermont who are not licensed and therefore not properly educated – please list the name of the school(s) in their post as well as how many purported teachers are in their employ.
After all, there MUST be sufficient accountability for these institutions, as well as for the VT legislators who have spent the last few years, at taxpayer expense, conniving & conjuring to find a way to resist providing reimbursement for students who attend religious schools!
DAVID DAVIS: “Support”?? From a poster?
I alone hold the full support from the UNITED STATES DEPARTMENT OF EDUCATION.
You reference nothing but attest your falsehoods to be accurate.
I bring the weight & backing of the entire federal government to bear upon you & your fallacies and yet as a zealot who attempts to reign repeated falsities about religious schools and their superior offerings for children, you attest to: NOTHING.
DAVID DAVIS:
WHERE, PRAY tell, is that list of VT schools who employ unlicensed, unqualified teachers I requested?
The state needs to be notified, after all!
Looks like your case is a LOST cause.
Per David’s request, I typed in on my Brave search engine using AI and this is the response I got regarding licensure in Vermont at private schools:
“Vermont law does not require private school teachers to be licensed.
However, potential educators must hold at least a bachelor’s degree in their desired subject area.
While a teaching license is not mandatory for private schools, individuals seeking to teach in public schools must obtain certification through the Vermont Agency of Education.
Some private schools may still prefer or require candidates to have a teaching license or relevant experience, so it is advisable to check specific school requirements.”
By the way, “thoughts” and “feelings” do not equate to facts and reality, as I alone presented.
I’m awaiting that list of private & public schools in violation of U.S. law………………………………………………
orangejude: But most importantly, what you all are neglecting to acknowledge is that U.S. law supersedes ANY state’s laws. Since the U.S. Department of Education mandates a license, as per their website – Vermont does not need to – Vermont, as a state, must follow that Department’s requirements. The license is a moot point.
What is NOT a moot point, however, is that because of that mandate & apparently in addition to VT’s COMPLIMENTARY state education department “certification”:
1.) There are ZERO unlicensed teachers
2.) All teachers in VT hold minimal education requirements
3.) Parochial schools do not employ teachers with merely high school diplomas.
4.) Many private/parochial schoolteachers have furthered their educations above bachelor’s degrees
5.) VT schools are indoctrination settings
6.) Vermont public school academic performances have fallen decidedly despite chronic school tax increases. Public schools are “tanking”.
7.) VT remains a state under federal jurisdiction in this matter
8.) VT is not an independent republic
But I’m still awaiting the list of “under-educated” & unlicensed teachers employed in Vermont – who according to a poster consist of individuals only maintain a high school level education.
FYI: it’s organic not orange 🤣…
How many Montessori Schools are out there that don’t require a Vermont Dept. of Education license? Because you are unlicensed does not make you unqualified. I have substituted for several classes at a private school and I only have a drivers license and a hunting license.
One More time:
The UNITED STATES OF AMERICA, a nation which VT is a within, REQUIRES through the U.S. DEPARTMENT of EDUCATION that all teachers must hold licensure in order to teach.
Therefore & thereby & in accordance with & henceforth: ALL Montessori schools are licensed and have teachers who are licensed and who therefore & thereby retain all qualifications which are subject to said license.
STILL waiting on that list of parochial schools in violation of U.S. law operating within VT.
Pardon….organic.
But now, back to the subject matter at hand……..
…..waitin’ on that list from “David”.
St. Johnsbury Academy, Lyndon Institute, license preferred but not mandatory.
Just typed in”federal laws requiring teaching license in private schools”
Answer returned,” there is no general federal law mandating teaching licenses for private school teachers”.
Dan, I already gave the information for the UNITED STATES DEPARTMENT OF EDUCATION for this thread. TWICE.
Now I gave it THREE times.
Then, I copied the FEDERAL REQUIREMENTS mandated for teachers NATIONWIDE.
There is no “debate” about this.
The FEDERAL GOVERNMENT has spoken.
There are no such issues as described by your friend “David”.
But I’m STILL waiting on just ONE example he can provide…………..
So far? Nada.
Kathleen, how is your blood pressure…? I’m serious, you seem to harbor a lot of anger in trying to prove something that isn’t going to change anything except your future health!
Thanks for confirming Dan.
Kathleen keeps stating that “NO teachers are instructing with a “high school” degree only.” Did anyone within these comments even make a legitimate claim suggesting the opposite??
And as far as parochial schools employing teachers that don’t have a Vermont educator license…Mount Saint Joseph in Rutland has plenty of them on staff. They might be college educated, but they lack the accreditation required by the state to teach full time in a public school setting.
Here’s the state’s educator license look up tool if anyone would like to see for themselves:
https://edlicensing.vermont.gov/public/search?_gl=1*1s7wuv*_ga*MjEyNjQzMTE1OS4xNzY2ODY4ODk5*_ga_V9WQH77KLW*czE3NjcwNDMwNTkkbzUkZzAkdDE3NjcwNDMwNjYkajUzJGwwJGgw
“License” or “Certification”. Bachelor’s degrees are a MINIMUM requirement. Every state. Everywhere.
All states still fall under the US Department of Education requirements.
Some states allow certain time periods to attain their particular requirements. NYS gives teachers 5 years to complete a master’s degree which is THEIR minimum requirement for teaching.
But AGAIN, there are NO “special” requirements nor exceptions for parochial schoolteachers allotted by the federal government. NO teachers are instructing with a “high school” degree only.
None.
READ THE FEDERAL MANDATES ABOVE IN MY POST. IT IS TAKEN DIRECTLY FROM THE FED’S SITE.
Oh, never mind.
…..Still waitin’ on David’s list.
…..Still waitin’ to learn which teachers are instructing in which religious schools here without a four-year college degree. Minimally.
My b.p. is good. The diastolic is a tad low, if you really want to know.
I actually enjoy challenging the nonsense spread by the left in order to mislead the public in order to advance their anti-science, anti-religion, Godless agendas.
The dudes especially cannot tolerate it when a woman confronts them tenaciously. It most definitely injures their apparently very fragile egos.
But why let them lie? Isn’t that what this site is for? Why allow them to attempt to denigrate parochial schools claiming teachers therein don’t need college educations. And the “standards” for them is lower than public schools.
I get it. I don’t back down. I’m originally from NYC. Them’s the breaks. Whatdaya gonna do?
Show me specifically where my own words denigrated parochial schools by claiming “teachers therein don’t need college educations”
I don’t appreciate being misquoted, especially after you’ve just admitted that you’re here willingly challenging and confronting those with different opinions.
Nothing I’ve shared or claimed here is a lie.
I’ve made no mention of your character or personality, but you have now made numerous false and unflattering assumptions about me.
Guy, enjoy your curated collection of commentators in the new year. You won’t hear from this “fragile ego” again.
Sorry: Once again, the state of VT falls under the already posted Federal Department of Education.
And here is the Diocese of Burlington’s personal “assurance” for you, “David”:
“All Vermont Catholic schools are accredited.
All schools in the Diocese of Burlington are fully accredited by the State of Vermont.
Additionally, St. Paul’s Catholic School is accredited by the New England Association of Schools and Colleges.
Vermont’s Catholic schools are recognized for their quality education and standards”.
Diocese of Burlington (802) 658-6110
Perhaps personally speaking to a rep at the Diocese might allay your suspicions that parochial schools aren’t up to the “same standard” as are VT’s public schools, which again – produce some pretty poor standardized test results.
Lastly, substitute teachers have never been required to have a bachelor’s degree in either VT’s private OR public schools re: Dan’s comment. My neighbor subs at Burr & Burton(!) and never went to college. Hence, I guess Dan can work there too with the hunting license he has shared he holds.
Are parochial schoolteachers in Vermont licensed?
Yes, They are required to be licensed
In Vermont, parochial schoolteachers are required to be licensed to teach in public schools. They must obtain a teaching license issued by the Vermont Agency of Education, which includes completing a bachelor’s degree and passing required certification exams.
Diocese of Burlington, Vermont
(802) 658-6110
parochial schoolteachers are required to be licensed to teach in public schools.
Parochial schools are not public schools so the teachers aren’t required to be licensed lol.
Are you sure? Now that I realize that you are never wrong, I will bow out of this. You confuse me with talking about private vs. public vs. certification vs.licensure vs. parochial schools vs. state mandates vs. Federal mandates. Vs. Epstein. DRIP DRIP DRIP
Again, maybe try reading & deciphering the information on the websites of the two organizations I provided you with, instead of wasting time & effort in refuting what I state which is either copied directly from their sites or paraphrased from the site itself.
Time is a-wastin’. Tick. Tick. Tick.
And if you choose not to read that information verbatim, tsk, tsk, tsk.
I worked at Mount Saint Joseph, it is not a requirement to have a Vermont teaching license to work there. I put two kids through nine years at Christ the King. Not only do many teachers not have licenses, administrators aren’t licensed. Recommended, but not required. That’s the trade off for the crap pay. You can put whatever information you want out there, you’re wrong and your hubris is astounding.
David, posters Mark, Renee, and I all obviously arrived at a similar conclusion insofar as your suggesting/inferring that religious schools in VT (which are primarily, though not exclusively Catholic-based) are somehow substandard compared to the public schools of this state. You then listed the bases of your assumptions within a number of your posts – most of which turned out to be inaccurate and biased. I then cut & pasted portions directly from the websites of the Diocese of Burlington, the Federal Department of Education, & the National Catholic Education Association to refute the allegations that – Montessori Schools & other parochial schools aren’t licensed & that “teachers” in private schools need not have college degrees as per Dan. Again, substitute teachers are not required to have bachelor’s degrees within either private or public schools in order to “sub”. Parents very often, formally educated or not, take on these roles when needed.
As far as accusing me of referring to your ego or somehow otherwise personally insulting your character – I never mentioned you specifically whatsoever but referred broadly to “dudes” very generally.
In any event, yes – have a great New Year and I personally hope that this latest stunt the legislature has pulled which ultimately still involves denial of the right to freedom of religion as did the Maine case – is eventually lost. I realize you likely disagree. So, as the POTUS often states: “Let’s see what happens”. But no matter what happens, the legislators of this state are very decidedly discriminatory insofar as religion is concerned, IMO. Ever since 2022, they have very publicly shared their plan to subvert the intent of the Maine decision.
I never inferred that religious schools are subpar, I clearly wrote that I sent my kids to one. I have 17 years of Catholic schools. What is wrong with you? You clearly don’t know the difference between having a college degree and having a teaching license. To answer your question before, Rice, MSJ, St J, Lyndon, Vermont Academy, Vermont Christian, all employ unlicensed teachers that have college degrees. In fact, many public schools employ teachers without licenses teaching under a waiver due to the shortage of teachers. You clearly don’t know how to interpret the data your pushing in people’s faces and with your tone, how to engage in civil discourse. In three days, I won’t be here to correct you and you can have 100 posts in a thread not just 22 lol.
Well Chris, it appears as though the Diocese of Vermont must be posting information meant to deceive on their official website. If I were you, I would certainly confront them, and you can let us be all made aware what transpires after you do so. Please make certain to let us know the name(s) of the individual(s) you speak with so one or more of us can encourage them to remove false statements from the internet.
In the past, I have substituted at Catholic, Episcopal, & public elementary & high schools in NYS (to be clear, though I possess a B.A. plus, none was required just as in VT) and yet NO amount of a higher pay rate could ever compel me to be subjected to the horrific behaviors I encountered at the public schools ever again. As far as the parochial kids went, they were vastly better mannered and much more respectful than their public-school counterparts.
Let us know what the happens with your conversations at the Diocese.
This is right of the diocese website, AGAIN do not need a license, but would like one. I’m not going to contact the diocese because, I can read. I shudder that you were allowed around children.
https://www.vermontcatholic.org/schools/catholic-schools/employment/
Employment
Employees in the Catholic schools of the Diocese of Burlington have the opportunity to make a difference in the lives of the students and in the schools they serve.
Qualifications
Persons who seek employment as teachers in our Catholic schools should be dedicated and caring professionals and willing to support the Catholic mission and philosophy of education. Successful candidates for employment will be graduates of a four-year program from an accredited college or university and have or be willing to seek teacher licensing from the State of Vermont within a specified period of employment.
Application Process
Visit School Spring, an online application service website.
Return an application and required supplementary materials including preferences for grade levels and subject areas of special interest.
Information from qualified applicants will be provided to elementary and secondary schools in the Diocese of Burlington.
Principals from interested schools will contact applicants directly about available positions.
Human Resources for School Employees
Thanks to Riley Gaines for her interview with the schools coach and lawyer on youtube to bring attention to this. When I was in high school, I played some sports and I have fond memories of those days. So think about it, the school forfeited a basketball game because they felt that playing against a transgender player could injure their players. Teams have forfeited games over the years for various reasons, but none of those teams were suspended from the Vermont Principals Association. In 2023 Mid Vermont Christian was suspended indefinitely. I feel bad for the students who will never have those memories later in life. I hope they win all of the lawsuits.
Yes Chris…….keep “shuddering” – someone, a woman no less, who dares oppose your ludicrous & incendiary posts somehow shouldn’t be in contact with children….Lol. Again, your chronic and often deranged rages against God and specifically Catholicism, are often what law enforcement organizations search for on social media in order to identify individuals who pose potential threats to the public.
Unsurprisingly though, Montpelier apparently has very disparate standards.
I’ve cut and pasted on this thread the Diocesan official statements/proclamation for the teachers within their employ and their school’s standards. I’ve posted similarly from the US Department of Education.
Unexpectantly, you refuse to accept the credibility and accuracy of these organizations’ online official statements but, conveniently, likewise refuse to dispute them directly and thereafter provide the “evidence” of such confrontation and/or communications to demonstrate that their statements were indeed falsehoods and that your personal, skewed, biased judgements & related criticisms were, in fact, correct.
As was eagerly anticipated, no such communications – in the effort to substantiate your accusations to the contrary – were initiated.
Net.
Chris Cox: As far as Rice Memorial H.S. along goes: The school is accredited by the New England Association of Schools & Colleges, ALL full-time teachers are licensed (via the US Department of Education standards as posted), and SEVENTY-ONE percent of the current faculty members possess advanced degrees over and above that of the meager, minimally-required Bachelor’s Degree which public schools in VT require. What is wrong with you? Intentionally maligning and misrepresenting a school’s reputation online can be easily construed as slander or libel. As far as your equally false assertions with regard to the other Catholic schools you ramble on about, it is but now your turn to authenticate your general & reckless claims of their standards of operation with proof of direct contact, since they completely contradict the aforementioned public & official statements from the Diocese of Burlington.
Next.
You could be wrong.
You could be wrong.
And in fact, you ARE wrong.
Why not contact the school and affirm?
Oh, that’s right….you can’t. You don’t “need” to, your opinion suffices.
Riverside school a private school in Lyndonville, the science teacher did not need a Vt. license, nor did the Latin teacher or the art teacher or French teacher. When the science teacher took a job at Lake Region high school, he had to get certification after completing some classes at Johnson State.
However, I’m not.
Because my information, again for the fourth time, comes directly from the Diocese of Burlington and the US Department of Education.
If you want to claim you both have better “info” than does the federal government, have at it.
But that’s ludicrous.
And ’round & ’round we go.
Vermont school test scores are POOR.
Private schools test scores, graduation rates, college-bound graduates are all higher.
Fact. Reality.
The Diocese AND the US Department of Education have spoken.
Licenses and/or certification are required.
You state above “you don’t know the answers to this issue” yet you suddenly are aware of a plethora of unnamed instructors at a Catholic(?) school who are teaching under illicit circumstances.
And in obeyance to Chris, you remove your reply icon in order to “(supposedly) make it more difficult for others to retort other’s fallacies….it DOESN’T.
Neither Dan nor Chris trump the US Department of Education nor the official statements from the Diocese, sorry.
Their statements stand.
And neither of you have offered ANY evidence to the contrary.
I worked there doing all the maintenance for four years. I was good friends with all the employees there. I know of what I speak. I don’t have to misinterpret internet research to know the facts.
Kathleen,
When one creates an entirely new comment using the WordPress format the VDC employs, a reply button is presented, allowing subsequent commenters to reply to that specific comment. When one replies to an already existing comment, a reply button does not present itself. In other words, you can’t reply to a reply, only an original comment. If you scroll through any of these VDC articles you’ll clearly see this pattern. It’s a WordPress feature and is something that commentators have no control over.
The fact that you still don’t understand this and ignorantly and falsely accuse others of ill intent is quite telling.
Names of each of the teachers instructing in illicit manner – in violation of VT & particularly Federal requirements (which supersedes Vermont’s).
Names & titles & division of the contact persons you will have communicated with at the Diocese and the Department of Ed in order to corroborate that their official statements posted on the internet are falsehoods.
Until that is provided, all statements provided by you & Chris are speculative at best and slanderous at the other end of the spectrum.
Neither the Diocese of Burlington nor the US Department of Education posts spurious information on the internet.
Your refusal to provide exacting, decisive information directly from the sources you claim are affording deceitful public information merely demonstrates your purported information is itself deceitful and/or “misunderstood” at best.
Teacher’s credentials are not typically verifiable via the school janitor.
I admire your tenacity. You now speak of catholic schools and not private elementary schools. No matter how many schools any of us mention that don’t require Vt. State teaching licenses, due to our involvement with these schools, whether sending our children there or being employed there, you still insist that they operate illegally. Okay, you win but it’s a very shallow victory, still up for debate. Welcome 2026.
Never said I was a janitor, but you need to misconstrue anything somebody says. I don’t know about you, but I talked to people I worked with and have passed the essence of those conversations on in this forum. If you can’t believe me then it’s your issue, not mine. I would have thought that someone in their mid sixties would have learned that they might be incorrect on an issue or did not explore further into the facts that some of us have presented here. FYI, I am also a paralegal.
David, I realize that. But there is a way to remove the icon immediately which certain posters employ each and every time whether or not there are any responses to their posts. In other words, it is posted that way. But thanks.
No Kathleen, there is not a way for certain posters to remove the reply icon immediately while using a WordPress comment forum. If I’m incorrect I’d love for Guy or another moderator to correct me. Otherwise, stop making things up to suit your accusatory narrative.
I’ve done it myself David….once. I choose not to unlike other posters. It’s juvenile. And it doesn’t promote “equity”. Lol. However, interestingly, it is something that only the “progressive” or democrat posters engage in, kind of defying the “tolerance” which they claim to both possess and promote.
The way to remove it is right online if you search. Here’s a synopsis:
1.) Using CSS
2.) Installing a plugin
3.) Adjusting Discussion Settings (that’s the easiest & can be performed in less than a minute).
Nice job using Google search, but one needs to be an admin for any of that to work.
You have at least three statements on this page alone without a reply option.
Not because of anything you chose to do, but because they are themselves replies and as I’ve already stated, this forum only allows comment to be nested two deep, not three.
Nice try though……….Lol.
And both Guy and ALL the posters on here can view the methods for removing the icon equally!
Saaaaay……..wait a second……..it looks like there are only three distinct posters on this thread who habitually have the reply icon go missing…..
Wait just one cotton-pickin’ minute! Whoops!
Renee McGuinness and organicjude piser
each have numerous comments on this page that don’t have a reply option. Is it them?
But that’s not because of any nefarious intent on their part. It’s simply because as I’ve already mentioned, you can’t nest comments three deep here, only two deep. An original comment can be replied to, that secondary response does not generate a reply button. It’s not a conspiracy and it’s not done intentionally.
If I’m wrong here someone else please chime in to say so.
Look David Davis with NO reply icon again. And yet y way of his comment, he’s posing as a luddite.
Sorry – looks as though the lefties not only have no tolerance but they cannot admit defeat either.
Those instructions are for P.C. users – Guy cannot adjust MY personal settings….
Nice try again, though. NOT. Lol.
Either way, another rather moot diversion…..because, in the end, Catholic schools ROCK!!!
And, all three are lagging behind. Lapped you long ago. Guess “native” NY’ers are indeed tenacious. Thanks for the compliment, Dan.
Accusing others of creating diversion…when you are the only one that has brought up these accusations of hiding replies. Comedy at this point.
Oh, and Dan…..I forgot to mention – Janitors are generally regarded as part of a maintenance staff. Not administrative, but of course. But do yet again feel free to provide evidentiary proof demonstrating such is untrue? Beyond a reasonable doubt, but of course……BTW, what “law firm” are you employed by? My brother is a an attorney primarily practicing in NYC but can & has practiced in VT. Such a small state, I’m sure he may very know you or your “firm”.
Let me guess…..it cannot be “disclosed”……..
I’m retired, at 72 years old, why should I have to be insulted by someone from Long Island. You should be old enough to respect others opinions. You don’t have to agree with me but you have no right to insinuate that I am a liar. I have only presented facts that I know are true. I once respected some of your opinions but not any more.
And just so we don’t go off-topic in order to create a diversion from the topic at hand:
Catholic schools are fundamentally superior to the current VT public school system and at the high school level have the aforementioned college acceptance/college bound rate at approximately 98%.
I’m guessing Burlington’s rate is considerably lower, since their SAT proficiency rate in math is TEN PERCENT.
Oh yes, English is much higher. At THIRTY PERCENT.
Great performance….good thing all the teachers are “licensed”!
Yet you have alleged throughout this thread that I am, in fact, lying. Tolerance goes both ways.
Further, you were the one who disclosed herein that you possessed merely but two licenses – a hunting and a driver’s license.
And while paralegals don’t necessarily have to hold one, over 99% do. And it is highly “recommended”.
And why so much animosity against Long Island particularly?
However, for your information, Queens County is a borough of NYC – not a county in either Nassau or Suffolk. It is only geographically part of “The Island”.
But why possess prejudicial views against L.I.? It sports a host of marine mammals and the best hockey team in the east.
I think you may have gotten played by another poster or two.
Allow them to fight their own battles.
But first, they ought to be courageous enough to leave their “reply” icon in place……
So that’s out.
I never once said that you were lying only that you may have been misinformed. I don’t care if you are from Long Island or Rhode Island but since you mention it in some of your posts, I thought I would bring it up. I’m sorry that you feel that no one else is right. I’m sorry if you feel hurt if someone disagrees with you. I’m sorry I ever got into this thread with you. I just ask that you look at the schools we mentioned and see if a teaching license is required. I’ve looked and was able to form a sane opinion, which I mistakenly thought would be respected.
No problem. None of you three believe I am right. So….there’s that. One more time yet again: I quoted verbatim the Diocese of Burlington’s official statement on their licensing of their teachers – and they have affirmed that they are indeed all licensed. Therefore, individual accusations or conjecture to the contrary are not legitimate because they are not verifiable. If you can definitively prove that the Diocese is providing false information, apart from the aforementioned conjecture, you can provide it via written records, documents, or video evidence. And I’m not “hurt” whatsoever, but the mere fact that as a male you feel compelled to portray me in that regard, when I’ve been merely staunch and resolute in presenting my facts, is based upon gender stereotyping.
In fact, it is obvious instead to me that it is the males in this and other similar threads, based upon their personal attacks (read through them herein yourself, they all remain for perusal, I need not reiterate them) have ego’s that are injured or “hurt” specifically by women who refuse to submit.
However, and yet again, this doesn’t alter the reality that Catholic schools per say are both educating and shepherding their student body in a superior manner based in part upon the test score results attained by the students in the VT public school system. And in the end, THAT is what counts.
And one more time, I am not talking about Catholic schools, just private schools.
OK, that’s not what the thread portrays, but I’ll accept it. But you did get played by some fellow posters. As for me? It’s been amusing. And enlightening, particularly how certain individuals (not referring to you) are bound & determined to attempt, albeit always unsuccessfully, to denigrate the Catholic church & its followers and the profound influence(s) it wields worldwide. The unbridled degree of anger some display here is both frightening and yet sad – as the rage they exude merely reveals the general degree of misery they must harbor within their lives.
No mo’ removing icons, David…..the clock is ticking toward midnight. Well, you’ve got a few hours left to take a few more swings and then run. How equitable, tolerant, and courageous!
I went to sleep, it was 2025, I woke up to read these posts, and I think I’m back in 1968, on the playground in 3rd grade, to my classmates arguing
“I know I am, but what are YOU?! 😆
Blessed are the peacemakers!
Happy New Year!
Took a wild turn huh? Pride is the route of most every argument, I’m right and you’re wrong. Let me prove it. Why would somebody argue endlessly that the law of gravity works?
Our educational system is broken and expensive, most would agree on that.
We could go back to two room school houses, put up star link, and educate our kids for $3500 per year with a school hall monitor and get decisively better outcomes.
Nobody wants to touch that.
Funny how home schoolers excel, not teachers even needed.
Something is wrong in our state, we are going to find corruption in Vermont like Minnesota, just a lot more sophisticated, make no mistake many grifters on the state teet.
Why are you removing your reply icon Neil?
No one has any control over the icons. If you hit the comment icon and make a statement, the reply icon comes up to reply to just that comment. When someone else makes another comment, it starts all over again. When two people make comments or replies at the same time, they might not appear in the order you expected. I’m not a computer expert, just observant.
And I already gave you the precise instructions as per the site itself in order to do so, but as with the US Department of Education – they too are providing disinformation. But you are right. You are apparently not a computer expert. As far as those who remove them, they are but cowards.
Why are you removing your reply icon Kathleen?
Kathleen still won’t tell us why her comment here doesn’t have its own reply option.